PATREON REPLAY: Sarah & Nippy Answer Your Voicemails

[00:00:00] This winter, take your icon pass north. North to abundant access, to powder-skiing legacy, to independent spirit. North where easy to get to, meets worlds away. Go north to snow basin. Now on the icon pass.

[00:00:27] This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered legal, medical or mental health advice. The views and opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the podcast

[00:00:37] and are not intended to malign any religion group, club, organization, business, individual, anyone or anything. Hey y'all, Sarah here. Here's a replay of an A Little Bit Culty Patreon episode we originally published just for our lovely, lovely patrons.

[00:00:52] But now that it's been out there for a while, we asked our patrons and they said, go right ahead. Let people who haven't joined LBC Patreon know what they're missing with our blessings.

[00:01:00] So here you go. You can get more bonus episodes plus ad-free flagship episodes and other fun stuff over on Patreon, including lip balm. Nope, it's not a cult. It's just a little bit culty. Find us at patreon.com slash a little bit culty. Hey everybody. Hello girl.

[00:01:18] Welcome to Patreon. This is like so cool to have. It's like a clubhouse. Except we're in a studio and we're not in the house or a club yet, yet. It just feels... I did find a cool place behind the ARCO gas station tonight.

[00:01:33] Oh yeah? That's what you want to have your clubhouse? It looks pretty cool. Okay. It moonlights as a wine testing place. Yeah. But it had a clubhouse vibe to it. But it was a gas station? It was behind the ARCO gas station. On Roswell?

[00:01:46] On Roswell, which incidentally has a liquor store on the left and like a convenience store on the right and you enter through the same sliding doors. A little wine tasting venue in the background. Atlanta is full of gems. It really is.

[00:02:00] Full of gems. Well here we have some gems. We wanted to share some more voice mails and dig into some of them over here this week for our bonus mini-soad, bonus-soad, bonus at the Minnesota. Let's do it. Let's roll on to it. Alright.

[00:02:16] Hi Sarah and Nippy. My name is Julie. I love your show. I've learned so much about the cultiverse and I loved the VOW. I am always intrigued by some of the cults or the cult-like organizations that you guys cover and expose, I guess.

[00:02:39] I am curious. I have lots of friends who are involved with AirBond and this other company, Optavia.

[00:02:50] I know that they seem to be these MLMs, but I'm just curious what your thoughts are on these companies that pop up that tend to attract women in their 30s and 40s who are looking to maybe work from home or quit their corporate jobs.

[00:03:16] And just wondering if you are familiar with these companies and what you thought of them and if they wreak culty to you as they do to me. Want to hit that? You want me to?

[00:03:28] I'll hit it with the one. You can come in with the two. How's that? One, two, go.

[00:03:34] The short answer to the question is we've done two episodes on it with one with Douglas Brooks who explains it and he basically gets into just the foundation of it and the math on it makes it impossible for them to deliver what they promise.

[00:03:47] And we did another one with Liberia Blevins about the leggings one and she runs into similar problems but she also runs into how the organization becomes a little bit culty with the obligation and the coercion and stuff like that.

[00:04:00] So short answer, yes. Tell them to run from that. You can send them documentaries on our episodes if you want because it's got some good intel in it. And Sarah, I'll hand it off to you for the two.

[00:04:11] Thank you. I think that if you listen to those episodes, you'll see that the nuggets we glean from both interviews is that it's really the same processes of manipulation, coercion, deception and the number one thing that ties it all together is the illusion of hope.

[00:04:31] It's not that all MLMs are cults. It's just that MLMs use the same strategies in that it's impossible to ever achieve what you think you're going to achieve when you sign up. It's just impossible. The business model won't allow it.

[00:04:46] The business model won't allow it, just like the business model of a cult won't allow you to ascend to heaven during the rapture on a spaceship. Like whatever it is that you're signing up for, it's not going to happen.

[00:04:58] Do you remember when Eckhart was saying the upside to these cult leaders is that they have the ego self-destruction button kind of built into it? Too much ego will destroy it.

[00:05:11] That's this for the business model. The business model has kind of a self-destruct button in it because it can't deliver who it is and it's always doomed to fail.

[00:05:22] The thing is, if you're listening to this and I'm sure that we have listeners who are casual members of various MLM companies selling skincare or electrolyte powder or this or that.

[00:05:36] You might listen and go, well my group's not like that. These leaders are ethical and I don't experience it that way.

[00:05:45] That's great and I'm happy for you, but I guarantee you 99% of your friends are super irritated with you for trying to hawk your wares every time you see them.

[00:05:54] And listen, I was that person so I'm guilty of it and now that I'm on the other side of it and I'm meeting people and not in the back of my mind thinking about what product they might want.

[00:06:05] It's a huge relief. So I just have to be honest about that and I do have a couple of friends who are members of various MLMs and I'm trying to slowly drop hints.

[00:06:15] We ran into someone who had heard our episode said, hey I heard it. I have different opinions on that. Yeah, well because they're in a company and they've invested money and they can't look at it that way and I get it.

[00:06:26] So I'm just slowly planting the seeds that if you're feeling discomfort it's not your negative thinking. It's because the company that you're working with is not a real company. Real company. MLMs are not real companies. Sorry, that's my belief on that.

[00:06:46] And we might get one of our experts, Roberta or Doug Brooks to weigh in on some of these things as having special guests on our Patreon. Let's do it. So stay tuned for that. Okay, do you want to play the other one?

[00:07:00] Yeah, please do. And this is a message from Willow Bradner. I accidentally ended up in the online pre-newer world and found myself in a group called COD otherwise known as Clients on Demand.

[00:07:13] And even if you don't have me on your show I'd love for you to help find some other people who have suffered the consequences of COD. It's a $12,000 program that always makes you up level if you actually want to accomplish anything.

[00:07:26] And they have the I-RUS program meaning if Russ says I do so it's super culty and a lot of people have fallen for a lot of these bro marketing groups. And I just think that the bro marketing conversation is so culty and so worthy.

[00:07:44] And it just so happens that I'm somebody who witnessed and got out but never got fully in. So I may not be your person. Anyways, my name is Willow Bradner and I'm obsessed with taking down anything cult like both in my own personal practice and in the world.

[00:08:03] Thank you. Bye. Thanks Willow. I definitely want to do an episode on online business coaching because there just seems to be a whole lot of bro bullshit out there.

[00:08:10] It really is. And thanks Willow. I think she wrote us an email, I believe, and I read it a while ago because I remember it sounded familiar. Yes, I think that is a good one to do. Okay. Come in to you soon. But we have to familiar ourselves.

[00:08:27] Yeah, we have to find the best Willow Blower. Okay. Here's Lauren, who left a call last week and she's getting some serious fair gaming. What do you have to say, Lauren? Hello guys. I am Lauren Marie.

[00:08:46] I just left a group called Access Consciousness and it's run by a guy who came from Scientology called Gary Douglas. And he, his partner, Dane, here and there's a third in charge are the basically the equivalent of your Keith Reneary, Ben Tobox and Nancy Salisman.

[00:09:04] They claim to have 800,000 people on their database and they have probably a million followers on social between them. I'm not sure what actually they have but listening to your show has given me so much awareness and insight and allowed me to really see what they're up to.

[00:09:22] I'm also in Yanya's foundation of recovery class. I was in the group for 12 years and they married me and my husband. We both worked for them. I was in our circle. I still live down the street from the woman who runs the Australia branch of the business.

[00:09:43] It's essentially a pyramid scheme. It runs very much like Nexium. They have a coaching program. They use the tools that just almost identical to Nexium's EMs, etc., just different words. They launder money same way taking cash in class and carrying it across borders and never claiming it.

[00:10:03] They have several different companies in different countries. Also they have antique shops where they launder money. The second in charge guy, their bento box guy. He's a sexual predator.

[00:10:17] He brings women up onto stage and does free sessions, body work sessions on them and then pursues them to have sex, targets married women and then basically quote facilitates them on their relationship issues in class to try and get them to break up.

[00:10:35] I was publicly shamed and humiliated under the guise of coaching so many times. They literally tell people get happy or put a gun in your mouth and shoot yourself. There's been several deaths that have been loosely linked. One guy murdered his nine-year-old son and then himself.

[00:10:57] They are very anti-vax that was a part of that story. I feel like I'm running out of time so I gotta speed up. There's a lot of bad shit they do. They're still doing it. They're active.

[00:11:10] I left. I spoke out last week and they're now accusing me publicly of stealing from them, sleeping with their husbands and I have all of that on tape. I posted one thing on Facebook, got a whole bunch of support.

[00:11:24] There's a whole bunch of people that have left and want to speak out. I'd be happy to come on the podcast. Wow, Lauren. Oh, wow. I'm going to reach out to Lauren. I think that would be a really good episode to do a deep dive into.

[00:11:37] Many people reached out to us about access consciousness. It definitely sounds like a nexium life-spring landmark Scientology smorgasbord of large group awareness training goodness. Man, that was tough. There's just so many. No, it just doesn't end.

[00:11:55] It just doesn't end. I mean, that's called the verse for providing content to the end of time. Do you think we're ever going to stop hearing about cults? I don't think we're going to stop hearing about them, but... Maybe this will become something else in the interim.

[00:12:10] Thank you, Lauren. Don't give up. I will email you and also know that the sooner that you and your cohorts can get organized and maybe create a blog so people can come and hear the truth.

[00:12:22] If people search for your group and there's not like a coordinated effort to share the truth, it's hard for people to know what's what.

[00:12:30] Maybe even get ahold of some of the experts that we've interviewed and see if there's other things written that you can share so that your claims are backed up by an expert analysis. That's my advice for you. Okay, so should we do one more? Yeah.

[00:12:54] Here is a question from John about NLP. Hello, Sarah Nibby. My name is Jonathan and I'm enjoying the podcast and really enjoyed your Mexican documentary. I'm in marketing and I have heard and seen lots of my marketing friends pursue certification in NLP or neuro-linguistic programming.

[00:13:19] I understand that Nancy Saltzman, who was either the perfect or band-band coach, studied NLP and it was part of the Mexican training. I'm curious how much of NLP made it into the Mexican material? Whether the technology is a quote good tech to learn and apply? Thanks much.

[00:13:40] I have an answer to this. Sure. What I do remember them saying is Nancy said that she studied with Bander and Grindler. I think the guys are one of the origins of NLP. Yeah, the founder is right. And she was touting Keith's genius and greatness and all that.

[00:13:59] And she's like, Keith was able to take a 14-day training that she taught and put it in two days of ours, the first two days of ours. So I know the first two days has a lot of NLP, particularly communication at cause. And maybe nature of emotions.

[00:14:17] And specifically things like understanding, and actually Mark Fasante talks a little bit about this and what the bleep that you have this little window of awareness when you're taking in the data that's around you.

[00:14:29] She says that she says in the module and even when she taught it that this is what she learned in NLP. Yeah. And she actually says in the module when she's teaching it, Bander and Grindler said. Said. That's why is it?

[00:14:42] What is it that there's two miles of information? We are taking. Two million bits of information we're only taking in I think seven plus or minus two bits of information. Yeah, in terms of all the sensory data that's coming in.

[00:14:53] And then we have to construct the rest of it to make sense in Function Society. And that particular aspect of it was actually very helpful I found for me for communication.

[00:15:02] When you put numbers like that to me, it's like saying, oh, you know, and drama is 83 million light years away. Like I'm like, okay, it's far. Yeah.

[00:15:10] I mean, it's far in so far as like I'm understanding that the data you're taking in is different than what I'm taking in. Right. And as a married couple and we have a fight and you remember something and I remember something else.

[00:15:20] It's not that, you know, we're incompatible is that you process information differently and that way more efficiently. Case in point. I didn't get far of that joke. No, you did.

[00:15:33] But I remember having something with somebody that I used to fight with a lot and, you know, she Nancy explained the difference. Between auditory, what you take in through your ears, digital or auditory tonal. I'm super, super, super tonal. That's an LP. That's an LP.

[00:15:49] And I remember having an awareness that there was a person that I used to, you know, it was confrontational in my life. And I realized is because she was digital and I was tonal and I was late for seeing her like five, five, seven minutes late.

[00:16:03] No, it was a bit more than that 15 minutes late. And I showed up and I know that was important to her. So I said, I'm sorry, I'm a little late.

[00:16:09] And she goes a little late to which I reacted to her tone and she was reacting to me saying little the word little is a digital. That's a, her meaning of the word little was not 15 minutes. Little would have been five for her.

[00:16:23] Anyway, we had a big fight, but then I realized like, oh, this is me processing and like she's not aware of her going, oh, little late in the how that sounded critical. So someone who's tonal like me hears criticism in a way that some people may not intend.

[00:16:38] Does that make sense? Yeah, that's the valuable aspects of what NLP can facilitate. Yes, LP can be valuable. I listen, we're not experts, but what we do know is that all these tools and ironically Nancy even, and Keith even said this in the curriculum, a scalpel,

[00:16:55] a small scalpel in the hands of a surgeon is different than in the hands of a murderer. And this NLP is a tool. You can use it to help and you can use it to hurt.

[00:17:05] But certainly Nancy was quite skilled in teaching it and she was skilled in making sure it was a big part of the curriculum. And I think we're still finding out how, but the other aspect is in rapport and maybe we'll save that for another.

[00:17:21] We're thinking about doing more breaking down the modules in Patreon. I think we should. Yeah, that would be fun. That would be most interesting. So thank you, John, for that question. There's two coverage lines here.

[00:17:34] One is we also reached out to a friend to get their opinion on this. We also reached out to an expert for their take on this issue. So thanks everybody for listening. There'll be some more Patreon bonus including we're going to be in Albany this week.

[00:17:51] Albany, New York. We're going to do a little behind the scenes of our adventures there. We have to go to upstate for a wedding, which we're very excited about flying through Albany, which I'm just embracing that. Wolf Road. Oh God. Cheesecake factory. We're going to be there tomorrow.

[00:18:05] The memories. I'm anxious. I had some anxiety come today and I was like, oh my God, I'm going to Albany tomorrow. I swear I would never go back there. If the Nancy Salisman sign is still there, I'm fucking taking it. Reserved for Nancy Salisman. We have to go.

[00:18:17] And I'm going to get a picture. We should get some pictures in front of the center. I'm going to take that sign. Okay, where are we going to go? Let's make a little list. That's going to go to the center. Right?

[00:18:26] I'm going to put that in our driveway. Reserved for Nancy Salisman. Apropos, which is now a restaurant. Excuse me, but the coffee sanctuary. What's that? Was it called really? Huh? It's a sanctuary. But what's it? It's not called the sanctuary. Professor Javas? Professor Javas? It's a sanctuary.

[00:18:43] It's not a coffee shop. And I apologize to all the baristas. I tried to recruit in the next year. I'm at Professor Javas. I know. Oh sorry. I'm at the whole... You can go to Norm's Shemarra. And Whole Foods, which is full of more next year memories.

[00:18:54] Oh my God. I had to go get my power suits for the training there. The only thing missing will be snow. Yeah. And Keith Reneary walking around the neighborhood with various very thin women. I forgot to tell you, I had a dream last night about...

[00:19:06] So did I, but like... Two people that have not reached out to us. And I know that they're like former coaches from Vancouver. One of them happens to be very tall. I'm not going to say his name.

[00:19:16] And in the dream, he was apologizing and we were both crying. And I was like, oh my God, I've had this dream so many times. And now it's finally happening. It was so real. And then I woke up and fuck it was a dream again.

[00:19:27] Am I ever going to have closure with these people? It's in her piece, Sarah. It's an inside job. Yeah. Thank you all. Thanks everyone. Thank you everyone. For sharing this journey with us. I love this journey for you Nipi. Oh thanks babe. That's it for now, Patreon peeps.

[00:19:44] Bye Patreon peeps. Thanks for so much for supporting this pod. Means the world. Leave us a voicemail. One final thing to the Patreon peeps. Give us an email what you might want to be interested in hearing about. Yeah. This is just bonus. This is just us sharing.

[00:19:59] We're going to adapt this to you guys. You get to craft the narrative. So it's, and this is obviously going to get more catered to you guys as we interface with you more. And that'll be fun. So. Amen. Not a culty amen. No. Whatever. Okay. Bye.