Rude Awakening: Sarah Landry On Nithyananda & Other Nightmares (Part 2)

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[00:00:20] Rude Awakening

[00:00:29] Welcome to A Little Bit Culty, a podcast about what happens when something that seems like a great

[00:00:34] thing at first goes to the dark side and takes you with it. I'm your host, Sarah Edmondson.

[00:00:40] And I'm also your host, Anthony Ames, aka Nippy. Sarah and I met on love in a quote self-help

[00:00:45] organization that turned out to be a mega cult called Nexium. Heard of it? We got out of

[00:00:51] there together and on our way out we helped shut it down. Our journey as Nexium whistleblowers

[00:00:56] was captured in detail in a docu-series called The Vow on HBO and also on the front page of a

[00:01:01] newspaper. New York Times, babe. Right. Have you heard of it? Each week on A Little Bit Culty,

[00:01:06] we talk with other former cult members and whistleblowers plus experts in things like

[00:01:11] cultic abuse and coercive control. We also turn the mic over to advocates and clinicians

[00:01:16] with wisdom to share on recovering from everything from MLMs and toxic religion to bad romances

[00:01:21] with raging narcissists. There's always something to learn about the cultiverse.

[00:01:25] Be sure to subscribe to A Little Bit Culty so you don't miss an episode.

[00:01:29] Find us on Instagram and at alittlebitculty.com.

[00:01:47] Welcome back everybody. Here's part two of our chat with Sarah Landry, who helped build a YouTube

[00:01:52] kingdom for a shady guru and is now whistleblowing her little heart out. See our full show notes

[00:01:57] for more of the backstory or if you haven't heard part one, back on up and check it out first.

[00:02:02] And just a word of warning. This episode covers sexual assault, child abuse,

[00:02:06] and all kinds of potentially triggering stuff. Please listen carefully and take good care of

[00:02:10] yourself. Here's part two with Sarah Landry. So thanks for explaining what was good. I think

[00:02:30] we got it. I feel it. I'm with you. When did it go bad? And what were the red flags

[00:02:34] along the way that you missed that you now know were there? It started to go bad

[00:02:39] the day I physically moved into the Audinam and surrendered as an Audinovossi,

[00:02:45] so a resident of that Audinam. When you're there as a program participant or a visitor

[00:02:51] or a casual devotee, they put up this facade. I like to call it the Potemkin Village that he

[00:02:57] puts up where you walk in and you only see like the clean fronts of the buildings,

[00:03:02] the landscaped gardens, the good stuff. But when you actually go behind the scenes,

[00:03:07] none of it is real. Even the buildings aren't real buildings, they're just stones that people

[00:03:13] threw together and slapped a steel roof on like nothing in his Audinam is real. And

[00:03:20] the persona he puts up during the satsang discourse, he would say like the scent of

[00:03:25] Advaita is friendliness, which the way you can tell whether or not somebody

[00:03:30] is in a space of oneness is that they'll be friendly. But you go into a meeting where

[00:03:35] he's talking to his Audinovossis and he'll say friendliness is Advaita, that's for the public,

[00:03:41] but here ferociousness is Advaita. And you can tell somebody is integrated by how much they will

[00:03:46] blast you if you have incompletions. And so everyone was actively encouraged to yell at

[00:03:52] everybody else if you saw somebody else doing something that you perceived as being out of

[00:03:57] alignment with his instructions. So an example of that, he would tell me to make three YouTube

[00:04:04] videos a day and three Facebook lives a day. And if anybody caught me doing something like

[00:04:10] sipping some water or anything, having a conversation with somebody, if I hadn't yet

[00:04:17] met that goal, they were supposed to yell at me and vice versa. So there was a very toxic

[00:04:23] interrelation between all of us where you have to be responsible for everyone around you.

[00:04:30] And if anybody around you was failing to live up to his instructions, then it's your failure.

[00:04:35] You're supposed to make them succeed. And he divided up the Audinum into teams and each team

[00:04:42] had a different responsibility. So the temple team did all of the sacred rituals and the

[00:04:48] gurukul team taught the kids the welcome center team, you know, greeted guests and

[00:04:55] served them coffee and tea. There were, I think, 25 teams when I joined. And the first red flag that

[00:05:01] I ignored was that when Nityananda would call team leads to give them instructions, there was

[00:05:08] nothing at all about meditation or enlightenment. And I had gone in thinking this whole little

[00:05:16] society exists to give people an experience of the inner space or the connection to the divine.

[00:05:24] But instead, he would focus on numbers. How many people did your team bring in?

[00:05:30] How many views did this latest video get? How many people have paid in advance for the program?

[00:05:35] How much donation money did you collect? So it was all geared towards bringing in new people

[00:05:42] and raising money. And another red flag that I kind of brushed past was that Ranjita,

[00:05:48] so the same South Indian actress in the sex tape, she was always with him.

[00:05:52] She was the only one in the cult who didn't have either a bed in the dorm or a room with a roommate.

[00:06:00] She slept in his bedroom with him and they told us that they've both gone beyond sleep and that

[00:06:06] she's his administrative head. She's like his personal secretary. And so they're working 24 seven,

[00:06:13] but if I hadn't been in like a sleep deprived brainwashed state, I'm sure I would have figured

[00:06:19] out no, they're just acting like a couple. Right. Keith had one of those two or three of those

[00:06:23] way and multiple of them, but one main one that was with him all the time.

[00:06:26] We just didn't think the teenagers were the ones. Yeah. So Ranjita, I like to call her

[00:06:30] the G-Lane Maxwell to his Epstein because she was his right hand woman. Everybody in every

[00:06:37] department reported to her with our deliverables and their work for the day. If anybody was

[00:06:42] out of line, we had to report it to Ranjita and the international sangha had to do the same thing.

[00:06:48] So all the temple heads all around the world would go to her for permission to do things

[00:06:54] like something little late. Can we buy new clothes for the deity up to something big?

[00:06:59] Like can we host a program on the weekend? She would either say yes or no. It was up to her.

[00:07:04] Did you notice that all these male abusers have a female sidekick that's aiding and abetting?

[00:07:09] Yes. It's nuts. Exactly. It must extend them credibility or it's just...

[00:07:14] Yeah, like he uses their natural nurturing female essence to his benefit.

[00:07:22] She was not nurturing though. She was terrible to all of us. And I think that what Nitti did

[00:07:27] with Ranjita is that he had to make somebody the bad guy because he wanted everyone to be

[00:07:33] devoted to him, worship him, love him, believe in him. So if he wanted to yell at somebody or

[00:07:39] tell them that they're a piece of shit or that they're not accomplishing their task,

[00:07:43] he would do that through Ranjita. And then if people said, Swamiji, I feel incomplete.

[00:07:47] She's bullying me. She's blasting me. She slapped me. She yelled at me. She told me to get lost.

[00:07:53] He would say, I'm so sorry, dear. I'll talk with her. And then he would

[00:07:57] tell her to apologize. He triangulated.

[00:07:59] He triangulated. And she wasn't the only one. So she was like his first wife. And then he had

[00:08:05] all his other concubines. And he called that his SM team, which is incredibly narcissistic.

[00:08:12] SM stood for the Sanskrit word, sacha lamurti, which means the moving deity. So he was like

[00:08:18] claiming to be like the living god who walks and talks and his SM team would prepare his food,

[00:08:25] feed him, clean his room, do all that kind of stuff and give him blowjobs and give him blowjobs.

[00:08:31] And if he had a crush on a guy or a girl because he was bisexual that way, the SM team

[00:08:40] would try to normalize that abuse and say, well, this is what we do. He doesn't have lust,

[00:08:45] but the physical body needs to release this energy. It helps him stay grounded. It helps

[00:08:51] him remain alive in his physical form and you're blessed. He felt that your vibration is high enough

[00:08:57] that you can do this. And so the SM team led by Ranjita would train other victims to serve him.

[00:09:05] Like when I blew the whistle, I knew that he was doing this to men and women. It's only in the

[00:09:10] past year or so that I found out he was also doing this with kids. And that's what makes it

[00:09:15] extremely maddening. Like I remember watching the vow and hearing about like the 12 year old who

[00:09:21] Keith raped and thinking, well, at least Nithi didn't go that far. At least his victims were adults.

[00:09:27] But now I know he did. He did do that with kids as young as 12 that we know of.

[00:09:31] How did you find out? Jesus. One of my friends who escaped the cult told me that one of his

[00:09:38] first children victims who were among the first three students of his Guru Kool had confided

[00:09:44] in her and said the reason I asked my parents to pull me out was that he did this to two of us.

[00:09:49] So two of the first three kids got abused like that. One of the girls who is being trafficked

[00:09:54] right now, one of her friends told me that when she was still there, the two of them were working

[00:10:00] really closely together as leads among the Guru Kool students. So he would make the older

[00:10:06] kids take care of the younger kids. And the girl I spoke to was one of the older kids.

[00:10:12] And she told me that there was a time one of her friends left her cell phone on the table where they

[00:10:18] were sitting and got up to go to the bathroom. And for some reason, this girl picked up her phone

[00:10:24] and saw that it was open to Facebook Messenger messages. And one of the groups that this girl

[00:10:29] who was 15 at the time was a part of it, that Facebook chat group was called the Suck and

[00:10:35] Fuck Club, the Nithyananda Suck and Fuck Club. And so this girl opened that stream of

[00:10:40] messages. There were a couple of kids in it and these 15 year old girls were sending nude selfies

[00:10:46] into it. And Nithy was putting heart emojis on those and asking them, what will you do to me

[00:10:51] when I bring you to my room? And they were, yeah, just describing in detail what they would do to

[00:10:57] him. And so that's how we know that the older girls, the older but still, I would say like

[00:11:03] 15 to 18 year olds. And then once a kid turned 18, and we assumed that there was a male equivalent of

[00:11:10] that club from things some of the boys have spoken about as soon as a kid turned 18, if he found

[00:11:18] that kid attractive, he would bring them on to his SM team. And it was a beauty pageant,

[00:11:23] whichever, whichever kids he thought looked the best. I remember one personal experience,

[00:11:30] I was sitting in the main hall and I saw two 17 year olds and one 16 year old girl went backstage

[00:11:38] to his green room. And his green room was like luxury. It was the only place in the hall with

[00:11:44] air conditioning, like he had the best luxury stuff. So I saw three girls go back there.

[00:11:49] And then one of them came out while the other two were still there. And the girl who came

[00:11:54] out had this look on her face. She wasn't crying, but she looked really disturbed. And I asked her

[00:12:00] what was wrong and she said, ma surupapriya, can you please get me body wax? I asked her what she

[00:12:06] what she meant by body wax and said, do you mean makeup? Like what, what do you mean?

[00:12:11] And she said, no, Swamiji told me all of his princesses have to present themselves as princesses

[00:12:18] so we can't have any body hair. And I told her we can go to the place where they provide supplies

[00:12:24] for adinavasis, like there was a little storehouse we could go to with like toothbrushes, toothpaste,

[00:12:30] shavers, shaving cream. And she said, no, it's Guru Vak for me not to shave. I have to wax.

[00:12:36] And that was a big red flag. That girl was 17. And she's now one of the missing girls.

[00:12:40] What was your final wake up? How did you get out?

[00:12:43] My final wake up, there were two incidents that happened when I was sent to Toronto after he fled

[00:12:50] India. Like he told all of us that he was in danger, that there were people trying to kill him and

[00:12:56] that he was no longer safe in India. And that's how he explained to us that he fled his rape case.

[00:13:02] You know, it was about to go into trial phase and he left the country with a fake passport,

[00:13:08] right? Fake passport. Yeah, he had an expired passport. He has lots of multimillionaire followers,

[00:13:14] so they fankrolled the full escape. That's what I was going to ask too is who's supporting him.

[00:13:20] I don't necessarily want to name them because I don't want to get sued. One of his close

[00:13:24] followers is one of the executives at Facebook. And I think that's why his child porn through

[00:13:31] Facebook Messenger has gone unprosecuted. He has a guy in India who's a billionaire,

[00:13:38] who's one of his close devotees from Bangalore. He's got people who are corporate lawyers for

[00:13:43] Google, who are his close inner circle people. They they know where he is. I don't know where

[00:13:49] he is, but they know where he's hiding because they go see him. So I think all of those people

[00:13:55] are responsible for maintaining his hideout. I was sent to Toronto and I was told get Nithyananda,

[00:14:02] political asylum, reach out to Trudeau, make connections with the Canadian government.

[00:14:08] And I laughed too. And I said, well, don't send me to Toronto. Send me to Ottawa if you want me

[00:14:12] to make connections with the national government. And they said, no ma, we don't have any devotees

[00:14:17] in Ottawa. You need to go to Toronto and stay in the ashram house there, which was so stupid.

[00:14:22] Like, if you want me to meet with Canadian politicians, send me to Canada's capital. I think

[00:14:27] they didn't know. I think they thought Toronto was the capital. So in some ways they're evil

[00:14:32] geniuses and then other ways they're stupid idiots. It was such a confusing process to try to

[00:14:38] navigate a reality where you're getting instructions from people dumber than you.

[00:14:44] We're very familiar with that. We're also familiar with that.

[00:14:46] So in Toronto, there were two kids. Like there was a 13 year old boy and a 12 year old girl who

[00:14:53] had her 13th birthday during the month when we were there. And one night those kids told me that

[00:15:00] they were scared to go back to Biddy D. Where the odd in them is. And I asked them why they

[00:15:05] didn't want to go back? Like, isn't that better than being stuck here in Toronto? You're the

[00:15:09] only two kids boys and girls aren't allowed to talk to each other. So there's two kids,

[00:15:14] one boy, one girl. They were so isolated. And I said, don't you miss your friends? Don't you miss

[00:15:20] your teachers? Don't you miss your parents? Their parents all lived in the odd in them.

[00:15:24] And the little girl just started to cry and she said, no, I'm scared to go back because of

[00:15:29] the December 31st incident that could happen again. And I asked her what was the December

[00:15:34] 31st incident? And then she kind of like shut down and withdrew and she looked over at the

[00:15:40] boy. And he was just nodding, like looking down really, really silent. I could see his eyes teared

[00:15:47] up. And there was another lady there with me, Balananda, who she's a retired school principal.

[00:15:54] She has a doctorate of psychology. So she's also one of his top American followers.

[00:16:00] And we kind of through eye contact, we communicated to just don't react,

[00:16:05] listen to what the kids say because I knew that if I said, wait, what happened? What happened?

[00:16:10] I knew they would withdraw and not want to say anything. So I just kind of stroked her head

[00:16:14] and said, you can tell us what happened. Don't worry. I'm a Guru Kul Acharya. So I have the

[00:16:20] approval to talk to kids. And then she told me that on the morning of December 31st, 2017,

[00:16:27] the kids were woken up by the head of the Guru Kul, Maadbate, storming into their dorm

[00:16:33] and dragging them out of bed, out of their bunk beds and telling them that they were the reason

[00:16:40] Nityananda's program failed. So this was happening towards the end of a $15,000 program called Mahasudashivoham.

[00:16:48] There were about 1,000 participants who would pay for this program. At the beginning of the

[00:16:53] program, Nityananda had promised whoever comes here will manifest third eye powers

[00:16:58] that they'll be able to see through their third eye, blindfolded, remote vision, telepathy, telekinesis.

[00:17:05] Like he promised all kinds of powers and people were starting to give the feedback that nothing

[00:17:10] was happening. They weren't feeling it. They weren't getting these powers. They're blindfolded.

[00:17:14] They don't see anything. So Maadbate goes into the Guru Kul. There's about 100 kids, 50 girls,

[00:17:20] 50 ish boys, and she told them the program is a failure and it's your fault. Swamiji gave

[00:17:26] the energy, but you are not entangling with the participants and therefore they are not getting

[00:17:33] these powers. So he was using a lot of scientific terminology like mirror neurons and entanglement

[00:17:41] and he had told these kids they have to manifest the powers and then go into entanglement with

[00:17:48] the program participants to make them catch those powers. Kind of like a hundred monkey thing

[00:17:53] but for fake third eye powers. So Maadbate told these kids you are so insensitive,

[00:18:01] you're so incomplete, you're so disconnected from Swamiji that you will never be able to feel

[00:18:07] his pain at your failure unless it's physical and with a stick she beat her own sons because

[00:18:16] two of her sons were in the school really, really horrifically like she broke one of the

[00:18:21] kids knuckles in front of the other kids and said in India it's legal for a mother to discipline

[00:18:27] her child physically, but it's illegal for an adult to beat other kids so she made them beat each other

[00:18:33] and I've heard this from like 10 different survivors now who were kids and so she first

[00:18:39] made one little girl beat all the girls and she picked that girl based on she had had

[00:18:45] a video go viral on YouTube where she demonstrates the third eye reading so she said you're the only

[00:18:51] girl who's integrated beat the rest of them so that they can break their patterns and become

[00:18:57] integrated and then she did the same she she appointed one boy to beat all the boys. The

[00:19:02] girl who was beating the other girls was crying saying I don't want to do this, I don't want to

[00:19:06] hurt my friends and the boy who was beating the other boys was a 17 year old forced to

[00:19:11] beat kids as young as like seven so he was crying saying I don't want to do this so then

[00:19:17] Maudevaite made all the kids beat each other and I looked at the little boy and said is what

[00:19:23] she's telling me like does that match your experience and he said it's worse than what

[00:19:27] she's telling me so the kids were super traumatized. I asked why did none of us know like how come

[00:19:34] only the gruel cool department knew that this had gone on how did I not see this

[00:19:39] and the kids told me that at the bottom of the thousand bed dorm where Adi Navasi stayed

[00:19:44] there was a floor that they called Nebus which is where the kids slept and she said Maudevaite

[00:19:49] don't you remember there was a week when the kids were locked in Nebus to do completion

[00:19:55] and I do remember this happened like for a week after December 31st that first week of January

[00:20:01] the kids didn't leave their dorm and there was like a big chicken wire fence that was locked

[00:20:07] at all of the openings and there were curtains drawn on the inside so we couldn't see in to where the

[00:20:12] kids were. I remember there was a day during that week when I had gone into the dorm to get something

[00:20:17] from a friend of mine who slept there and I remember a little kid's hand like sticking out

[00:20:23] through that gate holding an empty water bottle saying who's out there can you please get us

[00:20:27] water because the adults just left them for the day so she said they were locked up so that

[00:20:33] nobody would see the bruises the welds the black eyes the bloody noses like it was horrific

[00:20:39] the way these kids were beaten and that was my last straw caring about those beatings I was still so

[00:20:46] mind-fucked that I didn't realize it was Nithyananda who gave the instruction for that

[00:20:51] and so I thought maybe Maudevaite had gone crazy and that she had tortured all of these kids

[00:20:57] how many kids was it again about a hundred a lot of them are Americans

[00:21:02] are they still there or do they get out most of them are still there my god I've had two parents

[00:21:08] reach out to me and send me pictures of their kids and say it's thanks to your videos that these

[00:21:13] kids are not in that guru pool today too out of maybe 50 who had guru pool kids that's heartbreaking

[00:21:20] it was really really harsh we tell our stories we change the world a little bit culty is proud

[00:21:54] to support the hashtag I got out project which empowers survivors of cultic abuse to share their

[00:22:00] stories online as a catalyst for education prevention and healing learn more about the hashtag I

[00:22:06] got out movement and find resources at I got out org the frankies were a picture perfect

[00:22:17] influencer family but everything wasn't as it seemed I just had a 12 year old boy so up here

[00:22:25] asking for help he's emaciated he's got tape around his legs Ruby Frankie is his mom's name

[00:22:32] infamous is covering Ruby Frankie the world of Mormonism and a secret therapy group that ruined

[00:22:39] lives listen to infamous wherever you get your podcasts this episode is sponsored by better help

[00:22:48] what are your self-care non-negotiables maybe you never skip leg day or never miss yoga

[00:22:53] maybe it's getting eight hours of sleep I mean that's my personal and everyone's dream isn't it

[00:22:58] well I definitely have some non-negotiables like I'm in Vancouver right now and I'm spending

[00:23:02] literally as much time as I can outside of nature hashtag cold pools hashtag crushing it nature is

[00:23:08] a non-negotiable not enough time the fresh air and the trees around me and I start to feel

[00:23:12] not great not myself not grounded therapy day is a bit like my nature walks I try to not miss it

[00:23:18] and I know I'm just gonna feel so much better all around if I make it a priority I get so

[00:23:22] much out of it it helps me put my worries and anxieties in their rightful place and helps me

[00:23:26] clear my mind so I can focus on what I really need and sometimes what I don't need like I don't

[00:23:30] need to be overbooking myself just because I hate to say no to people you know what I mean thanks

[00:23:34] therapy thanks for helping me see that and if you're thinking of starting therapy give better

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[00:24:01] visit better help comm slash culty today to get 10% off your first month that's better help

[00:24:05] h e l p dot com slash culty you did mention in the doc that he did pursue things with you

[00:24:15] sexually oh yeah so he tried i won't say try he successfully entrapped me in his sexual

[00:24:22] web in 2016 and so i had started following him in 2009 there was not even a hint of sexuality

[00:24:29] until 2016 so i was fully brainwashed and wouldn't have believed that he was a sexual predator

[00:24:36] because i thought well if he was like that why why has he never tried anything with me

[00:24:40] he must be innocent i used to say the same thing yeah i think he does this on purpose

[00:24:44] he'll deliberately wait with certain people so that they have like plausible deniability

[00:24:50] and that's part of the way he's coasted with all his accusations is that there will be like 15 to 20

[00:24:56] gung ho inner circle people saying nothing like that ever happened and i would know because

[00:25:01] i'm right there with him they don't know because they're not with him 24 7 like rangita is i think

[00:25:08] she's the only one who would know everything but yet it started with facebook messenger messages

[00:25:13] where he told me you are my shakhi you are my baby you're the only one who understands me

[00:25:18] i'm your shiva we can't tell anybody about this year because they're not ready to accept

[00:25:23] an incarnated goddess only their shiva and so he kind of made me feel like it was my mission

[00:25:28] to win over everybody else he said if you establish your social media team so that it's

[00:25:35] the biggest team in the audience then we can join together as a divine couple and i didn't

[00:25:39] realize he was saying the same thing to at least a hundred other girls and a bunch of guys too

[00:25:45] that's consistent yeah yeah he would call me to press his feet the way jordan described in the

[00:25:51] docu series i think because that docu series was made for an indian audience they use

[00:25:57] jordan's abuse story and not also mine because it's very hard for indian people to hear about a

[00:26:03] woman getting sexually abused like it's a cultural store spot for them but something very similar

[00:26:10] to what happened to jordan happened to me okay but no i went to press his feet and the first time

[00:26:16] i went to give him this foot massage i believed that he was beyond gender beyond sex beyond any

[00:26:24] kind of human lust and at one point his hand kind of moved towards my chest and he didn't

[00:26:31] rope or fondle it's like the back of his knuckles were brushing against my breasts so

[00:26:36] i moved back and kept pressing his feet and i kept kind of distancing myself from him

[00:26:42] because his eyes were closed so i thought he's not aware of where his hands are like i was so ready

[00:26:47] to defend him but i didn't even think he was doing that deliberately and then later that night

[00:26:51] he sent me a text message and said you missed a big opportunity why did you pull away from me

[00:26:56] and it was like that was like my first holy shit moment where i realized he wasn't like in

[00:27:01] samadhi in like restful awareness accidentally touching me he was trying to start something

[00:27:07] wow it accelerated like the thank god the extent of my abuse only went as far as like a couple of

[00:27:14] hand jobs like i didn't have to do the same disgusting work that his sm team had to do

[00:27:21] when you had those advances happened how did that make you reconsider the stuff you had

[00:27:26] heard before it didn't because i had never listened to arty rouse interview i say i had never watched the

[00:27:33] sex tape with rangita i think i was very supremely innocent in that when he told me i was his

[00:27:40] incarnated shakhti i actually thought well that's how i know the rangita video is fake because

[00:27:46] if he's she but i'm shakhti he wouldn't be messing around with a human woman so she must

[00:27:50] really be just his administrative head and his personal secretary and his abuse towards me made

[00:27:56] me justify even more like the lack of credibility for the other accusations because you were the

[00:28:02] shakhti what broke that delusion was one day he sent me a text like a facebook messenger message

[00:28:10] he sent like a still from a porn sex scene of a threesome like there's this dude laying on a bed

[00:28:16] and two women were going at it and he said is this one of your fantasies and i replied back and said no

[00:28:22] like it's not and he said so it's not your fantasy but would you be willing to do it

[00:28:26] and i replied back like i'm a sanyasi i'm in the orange kavi which is like a sign of

[00:28:32] renunciation in hinduism and so that was a total shock like you don't expect your guru to send

[00:28:38] you horn and ask you if you'd be willing to do it so i replied back no i'm straight i've never

[00:28:44] been attracted to other women i'm not experimental like that i've taken the vow of celibacy so

[00:28:50] that's not my motivation in life and then he kept pushing it and said well what if it would

[00:28:55] lead you to your enlightenment then would you do it and i said well then yeah i guess so because

[00:29:00] it would be a top us like it would be a sacrifice but yeah the next day he called me to press his

[00:29:08] feet and he told me start looking around and pick another woman so it escalated fast this fucking guy

[00:29:15] jesus yep and he said it is she can't be married and she can't be a sanyasi so it's basically like pick

[00:29:22] a victim i had the audacity to ask him if i'm shakhti and you're a sheva why do you want to

[00:29:28] bring a human woman into the mix isn't that like your child because she was the father of humanity

[00:29:33] why would you be lusting after one of your own children and that day i got kicked out of his

[00:29:40] so-called palace like the apartment block sectioned off for him and his inner circle people he sent

[00:29:46] me to stay in the public dorm which was a huge downgrade so i lost my a c in my hot water shower

[00:29:52] i'm living now among the common people the common people yeah my friends i don't even want to

[00:29:57] say common people because i loved all of those i know teasing yeah it was a much less comfortable

[00:30:04] like now i had to eat the rice and sambar instead of like the gourmet food that was served in his

[00:30:09] palace and he told everybody that he had sent me out because i had become arrogant and that i was

[00:30:16] trying to keep him away from connecting to other females because of my jealousy

[00:30:21] i was forbidden to tell anybody like we were told the moment he sent us a message in facebook

[00:30:27] messenger we were told to lead it read it then delete it so my biggest regret is that i have no

[00:30:32] evidence to these texts because he made us delete them as soon as he sent them like one of the lies

[00:30:37] that they tell people in his cult to discredit me is that i was an implant that i was like a

[00:30:43] catholic missionary sent to destroy hinduism and what i want to say is if i was an implant

[00:30:49] i wouldn't have deleted all the messages he sent me i would have saved them for evidence

[00:30:54] the room where he had me stay it was the the room of his legal head so i slept among boxes of all of

[00:31:02] his lawsuit paperwork over the years i never opened a single box like had i known then what i know now

[00:31:09] i would have downloaded a scanner app on my phone and all that shit but i didn't you're not going

[00:31:14] to get logical debates out of anyone who doesn't want to see the truth so there's no point you

[00:31:19] can't let's tie a few loose ends up so you had a couple things that were heavy on the shelf and then

[00:31:25] how did you actually escape i escaped because in toronto the house where we were staying was only

[00:31:31] a small handful of sannyasis like i was one of four people in the orange copy there were three

[00:31:38] ladies there who were not wearing copy not fully surrendered and the lady who was there with me

[00:31:45] when the kids told me about the beatings at that time she was right there with me that this is wrong

[00:31:50] this can never happen again we have to leave this is a cult and i told her about all the sexual abuse

[00:31:56] stuff and she was shocked and so she helped me get away like we planned it out together that

[00:32:02] one morning when everyone else went to the toronto temple i would stay back and tell them that

[00:32:08] i'm not feeling well pack my suitcase go to the airport fly to calgary arrange with my mom to

[00:32:13] pick me up and be out so that was my escape i snuck out when the house was empty went to the airport

[00:32:19] took off the copy put on like jeans and a t-shirt and i was done wow it took me about six months to

[00:32:25] de-program like i still believed it's a cult the people are bad but swami g might really be an

[00:32:31] incarnation and i was gaslighting myself saying but what if i am an incarnation of daby what if

[00:32:36] that was to break my patterns so i did a lot of back and forth how did you do program did

[00:32:41] you get therapy or did you read or what was your healing yeah my healing i i became obsessed with

[00:32:47] cults like i watched every episode of Scientology in the aftermath and i was following the nexium

[00:32:55] case you had done your new york times article but it was before any of the docu series had come

[00:33:01] out but i was watching that full case taking notes like okay this is how they're exposing that

[00:33:07] psychopath like maybe one day we can do the same for our psychopath but i was also very isolated

[00:33:13] in the years after arty row went public nine years went by that not a single person ever ever spoke

[00:33:20] out and i didn't know anybody else the lady who would initially help me escape went full on back in

[00:33:27] started working as part of the guru cool admin team what no way when i finally went public a

[00:33:33] year after escaping the cult in the very first video that i made about the brainwashing and the

[00:33:40] child abuse i gave a public apology to arty row lenon caruppan and vinae baradwaj who were the

[00:33:47] three whistleblowers everybody ignored in 2010 and i told them now i know you were telling the

[00:33:54] truth i didn't see it then but i see it now and i'll take this up as my personal mission to

[00:34:00] pick it up where you left because they had all stopped speaking to the media like five years ago

[00:34:05] and i felt personally responsible having been his top recruiter that a lot of the people suffering

[00:34:11] there it's because of my youtube videos so it's kind of like i made this mess now i have to clean

[00:34:17] it up right and they launched a character assassination the day after i spoke up publicly

[00:34:23] where they falsely accused me of raping two kids they also accused me of poisoning the guru they

[00:34:30] said that he had to flee india because i was an assassin and poisoned him and they filed a police

[00:34:37] report to the raman agarra police that i had poisoned him and should be charged with i think

[00:34:43] they said like treason like a crazy nonsensical kind of a charge so i can never go to india

[00:34:50] because i'll be charged with raping kids and poisoning this fraud cult leader and possibly

[00:34:56] treason which i still don't understand that charge you even want to go back to india i mean i mean

[00:35:02] it's a beautiful place like i have no problem with the indian people just with this one called

[00:35:07] yes of course they told their followers that i was a demon like they at that time there was this

[00:35:13] viral suicide thing online where people would get sucked in and do challenges that led

[00:35:20] to suicide and he had taken my photo and morphed it with like the monster that appears in that and

[00:35:27] said she's the one who created this and it's her goal to make people kill themselves and if you

[00:35:32] listen to sarah landry's videos she will destroy your spiritual connection you'll lose your liberation

[00:35:40] and so the way we had all been scared in the early days that we will never watch the rangita

[00:35:45] video he scared his disciples so they'll never watch my youtube videos i think the best thing that

[00:35:51] i've had happened since then is that a few gruel cool kids have reached out to me and told me that

[00:35:56] when that happened the kids overheard the grown-ups talking that you know sarah landry says that

[00:36:03] kids were beaten can you believe it she's such a liar what a bitch why would she say this

[00:36:07] and so the kids had kind of banded together and whenever they could get their hands on the

[00:36:12] device they would walk out to an area in the audience where there was no supervision and they

[00:36:17] started watching my videos and the kids told me for them it was so good to know that there was an adult

[00:36:24] who was on their side who didn't want them to get beaten and tortured so that made it all worth it

[00:36:31] for me i hate the fact that their parents are unwilling to believe that it happened

[00:36:37] like there's so much cognitive dissonance right where anything the guru does has to be good because

[00:36:42] it's coming from him anything a whistleblower says has to be wrong because it's against him

[00:36:48] there's no logic involved it's black or white good or bad he's good we're bad in their minds

[00:36:53] you're not going to get a civil discourse they won't wake up until they have their own

[00:36:58] moment of clarity like you had when they can see something that affects them in that way until

[00:37:03] then all the terrible things that are said about him must be lies because he's good exactly and some of

[00:37:09] them may even think that you know that the beating needed to happen for the reasons that they said

[00:37:14] the beatings need to happen and i should the person in the vice documentary who was blurred out

[00:37:18] who was anonymous said something that really struck a chord in me she said that like even at

[00:37:23] the time she knew that the whistleblowing that artira was saying was true because she'd

[00:37:27] experienced it as well but the way that it was being exposed wasn't right and the way that

[00:37:33] was being brought to the world was wrong and so she stayed that happened with us too there were a

[00:37:37] lot of people who said they came to terms with like what keith did was bad but the fact that we were

[00:37:42] public about it and that we you know went to the media was unethical and then it should have

[00:37:46] been handled internally and it's just such a strategy to deflect bad action and immoral

[00:37:53] activity from all of these leaders actually keith taught us it's called the shifter strategy

[00:37:57] to shift the attention over here while you can do these other things

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[00:41:19] earlier you were saying that like keith and nithyananda and all of them will say

[00:41:24] if you listen to something that disturbs your ideal of the guru it will forever impact your

[00:41:31] connection like that will color your perception of that person if you hear something bad about

[00:41:36] them and i feel like that's why Scientology came up with fair game and that's why all of these cult

[00:41:41] leaders use that strategy if a whistleblower comes out and says kids got beaten they can't just go

[00:41:47] public and say no the kids never got beaten this is a lie and here's our proof no they have to

[00:41:52] attack your character they have to attack our character and so they're aware of the fact that

[00:41:57] if people google me now they'll come up to you know videos made of people crying saying she raped

[00:42:02] me and she's a sex addict and she kept me as a sex slave and you know it's it's ridiculous what

[00:42:08] they've said about you know the first person who interviewed me after i came out was the late

[00:42:13] rawn the scavenge and that was i think the beginning of my healing because we had a Skype

[00:42:19] call before the interview and i started to cry and i told him i don't think you should

[00:42:24] interview me because they're calling me a rapist a white supremacist an assassin and if you

[00:42:30] interview me they'll start attacking you and he just laughed and sent me the links to all the

[00:42:35] website Scientology had created against him and said no i know you're telling the truth because

[00:42:40] they're doing all of that right the day after the first episode of that interview got published

[00:42:45] on his youtube channel nithyananda gave a discourse about how great Scientology is

[00:42:50] that elrond hubbard was a modern-day reishi that society doesn't understand him but he's

[00:42:55] done such a great contribution to humanity read the room bozo i know he has but he has no idea

[00:43:02] so where are we now with you know he's on an island he claims that how is he getting away with it why

[00:43:07] isn't law enforcement gotten him who's supporting him yeah what's the status the status as of now

[00:43:13] is pending it's like i feel like there's a little loading icon on the story of his of his life

[00:43:20] because he's been in hiding for like two years now he claims that he's created his own nation state

[00:43:26] called kailasa and one really unfortunate thing is that he has support from a lot of international

[00:43:33] governments who are helping him through his bribery and one of the things that he did to try to get

[00:43:39] help in his fleet is he built up a whole brand narrative about his life where he claims to be

[00:43:46] the head of all hinduism the leader of two billion hindus worldwide he claims to be like the highest

[00:43:53] person in the hindu hierarchy and say that he is a persecuted minority that his organization is upholding

[00:44:02] one of the traditions of india that's being attacked by anti hindus and racists and people

[00:44:09] who are trying to commit a cultural genocide so he has had a lot of his close disciples including

[00:44:16] girls in the gurukul and women who are brahmachari means he has had them fabricate elaborate

[00:44:23] rape stories against anybody who has spoken up so journalists for example the journalist who

[00:44:29] tried to give him the court summons oh he was so badass i loved him by the way he was great

[00:44:34] me too yeah so he's been falsely accused of rape by one of nithyananda's disciples

[00:44:39] lenin has been falsely accused of rape and actually got arrested because of a lie of one

[00:44:44] of the disciples i've been falsely accused of rape they've collected all of these fake rape

[00:44:50] stories and put them together in a document showing that they are a persecuted indigenous

[00:44:55] minority group and they've presented that to the unhcr and they've gotten acknowledgement for

[00:45:01] it they've given talks at human rights seminars painting themselves as victims of this racist

[00:45:07] anti hindu attack that they claim i'm leading what the fuck the accusations against me are

[00:45:13] ridiculous they posted on twitter two days ago saying that i i personally committed

[00:45:19] cultural genocide against the first nation's people of canada and buried kids in mass

[00:45:24] unmarked graves at schools that i read so they're trying to pin the residential school

[00:45:29] atrocities on me and when i replied to that thread and said this is so ridiculous i'm glad

[00:45:34] you said this because this shows how crazy you are now they claim oh it wasn't me but it was my family

[00:45:40] and it's like dude my my ancestors were menonites they're like a pacifist that's a whole other

[00:45:45] cult i think but they were not they didn't do that twitter wars nippy is a great quote about

[00:45:51] twitter which i rarely look at because it's just so gross but what do you call it nippy

[00:45:56] the bathroom wall of social media i love it just don't even look i just don't look i mean

[00:46:03] otherwise they take up too much space in your mind you know i hope it doesn't bother you too much

[00:46:08] also twitter wars it's you know who looks at that and what happens if you win on twitter what do

[00:46:12] you win nothing what happens nothing happens yeah i like that twitter gives us an outlet to

[00:46:19] like a lot of nithyananda survivors who are scared to go public because they don't want

[00:46:24] the character assassination or to die mysteriously like a lot of people who left him dead or to be

[00:46:30] charged with rape by a lying disciple so they go to twitter with anonymous accounts and go into

[00:46:38] details about things they witnessed and experienced but with that safety of anonymity so i like that

[00:46:43] i like that it gives us that platform you can make it positive what do you want people to know

[00:46:48] was anything missing that's super important from the vice documentary that you feel

[00:46:52] needs to be shared what's missing from the vice documentary is everything that's happened in

[00:46:58] nithyananda's cult since he fled india other than the sensationalist story that he established his own

[00:47:04] country and what i mean by that is the human trafficking like a lot of people who signed on

[00:47:11] to live in his awning them have been told to fly to random countries some in south america some

[00:47:18] in africa with the instruction don't tell anybody where you're going don't look in the suitcase that

[00:47:25] we're giving you to carry go meet with this person and that government give them this money that

[00:47:29] we're handing to you so there's there's money laundering there's human trafficking both labor

[00:47:34] traffic and sex trafficked disciples of his they should have included rangita in that docu

[00:47:41] series um i didn't appreciate the fact that they didn't use her name and that they blurred

[00:47:46] her face and they made it seem almost like you know this poor woman has been shown in a in a

[00:47:53] compromising position on the media but she's not one of his victims she's one of his enablers she

[00:47:58] says right hand person and i feel like to understand the sinister nature of nithyananda people also

[00:48:06] need to understand the sinister nature of rangita because they are a pair in their crimes

[00:48:12] she trains his victims to serve him sexually she gaslights his victims to blame themselves

[00:48:20] for things that he does that hurt them i've actually heard some victims who survived that cult

[00:48:25] say that nithyananda was nice before rangita entered his life and i don't think so i think

[00:48:30] he was always a predator yeah that's part of the con and if she admits abuse is going on she

[00:48:36] has to admit that she's been abused and she's not willing to do that yeah and she's not willing to

[00:48:41] do that but also she she knows that she will go to prison as well for the crimes she's abused

[00:48:50] she slapped people she's beaten people she's instructed people to beat each other there are

[00:48:54] quite a few people who i think need to go to prison along with nithyananda and she's the

[00:49:00] top of that list and i think vice got too scared of the fact that rangita has sued indian media for

[00:49:06] showing the sex tape i was going to bring that up yeah so i think they they decided to just avoid that

[00:49:12] whole can of worms and leave her out of it but i think the public needs to know she is not a

[00:49:17] victim here she's one of the abusers with him that's very cowardly advice i got to say like

[00:49:24] well that's what allows this stuff to permeate cowardice at the top of leadership

[00:49:27] a hierarchies it's going on in all the extreme systems right now people are too afraid to stand

[00:49:32] up for it because they don't want inconvenience their comforts and their lifestyles to do what's

[00:49:36] right that's what's different about you sarah like the fact that you're still talking about this and

[00:49:40] you didn't just escape and move on with your life yeah seriously good for you thank you that means

[00:49:44] a lot especially coming from you two who are doing as much as you've done well we know it's not

[00:49:49] easy and it takes a huge drain on your life force and but i also know all right project anyway

[00:49:56] that is also as a former recruiter and advocate for our guru that you got to make it right you know

[00:50:02] and that's part of the healing journey for sure we'll certainly be following this and you know

[00:50:07] hopefully justice happens soon and when it does we'll have you back on and hopefully celebrate

[00:50:12] yeah i look forward to that sarah and i were talking before the podcast when someone starts to

[00:50:18] kind of put out that negative force whatever you want to call it you know that he's doing

[00:50:22] it immediately puts into motion it's demise and for the good to come it's only a matter of time

[00:50:28] i'm confident in that hope that happens soon and when that happens we'll do like an instagram live

[00:50:34] update hell for our audience hell yeah that'll be great yeah oh are we gonna do what tops my

[00:50:42] ass oh yeah of course oh yes thank you what chaps your ass i talked this through with all the other

[00:50:49] victims who are all anonymous our chat groups and yeah one of them so i listened to that podcast

[00:50:55] my auntie mary linn told me to tell you both that it's her favorite podcast oh hi mary linn

[00:51:00] thanks mary linn she's gonna freak out when she hears that like she listens to your song

[00:51:06] that the song at the beginning of your podcast and like that's even like her favorite song now

[00:51:10] oh by john bryant yeah we love that song too so what was the chaps what chaps we asked is that

[00:51:16] from the time arty and lenin went public they went to the police for help and said he's a sexual

[00:51:22] predator and that he's raped and molested 30 to 40 men and women even back then in 2010 and nothing

[00:51:29] was done about it and there was a bit of a media circus in india and then life went on and then

[00:51:34] when i went public i sent a police complaint to the department in india for protection of women

[00:51:41] and children to the bit of the police and to the raman agarra police and i forwarded a copy

[00:51:46] to interpol and nothing was done and we've sent tips to the fbi about his money laundering his

[00:51:52] entire financial base is in the united states and so we've we've sent all kinds of tips to all

[00:51:59] kinds of different police and he's allowed to keep raping people silencing people putting

[00:52:05] false accusations so what chaps might ask is that he is a monster out there in the world

[00:52:10] destroying people's lives and the un seems to be supporting him while he continues to brainwash

[00:52:19] people use people for money use people for sex service and bully and intimidate his victims into

[00:52:25] silence that's what chaps my ass that chaps my ass too it's so consistent with these guys because

[00:52:31] it sounds like he's probably bribing and buying off certain people that can keep him in a position

[00:52:36] of power also he has misinformation on his side so i don't know what to say with those agencies

[00:52:41] but it allows him a certain currency to to get away because yeah he's a guru and we'll see if

[00:52:46] there's anything we can do on our end with our contacts yes the presentation that he gives to

[00:52:51] the un it includes letters from heads of state in the us congressmen mayors and they've all

[00:52:58] signed off on it saying that some of their constituents have really benefited from this

[00:53:02] guru so please protect him and the top letter on his stack of letters is a beautiful glowing

[00:53:08] recommendation by susan serendip and so they've swindled a lot of people by saying well look an

[00:53:14] oscar winning actress is supporting him have you reached out to her i've tried i've tweeted at her

[00:53:19] but i don't think she saw my my messages you might have to go through her manager if we've

[00:53:23] learned anything when an actor endorses someone it might be a red flag yeah true we also know

[00:53:28] it's possible to like attend a retreat and be like wow this is amazing and then endorse it as

[00:53:34] was the case and for us many times for sure he could never get the golly llama the way he did

[00:53:40] right listen let's keep in touch let us know how we can help thank you so much sarah thank you so

[00:53:45] much for having me anytime imagine yourself walking into a forest you can see the path

[00:53:53] and the trees high above you the air is crisp you are walking towards your happy place allegedly

[00:54:01] allegedly say it with me anything said here on this podcast about alleged cults alleged mlem schemes

[00:54:08] alleged douchebaggery mindfuckery criminality spiritual fraud or the like is offered purely

[00:54:16] as commentary because the views and opinions expressed on a little bit culty do not

[00:54:21] necessarily reflect on official policy or position of the podcast and any content provided by our

[00:54:28] guests bloggers sponsors or authors are their opinion and are not intended to malign any religion

[00:54:35] group club organization business individual anyone or anything so just let these words drift

[00:54:42] into your mind without needing to focus on any of them you are great you are capable

[00:54:48] you deserve to be happy nobody's mad at you unless you're actually a narcissistic culty criminal

[00:54:55] if that's you cut that shit out don't be a fuckwad but if that's not you again you are great

[00:55:03] you are capable you deserve to be happy a little bit culty loves you okay nippy

[00:55:13] get me up with some nithanyanda word salad

[00:55:15] okay this is the word salad i took it straight from the dot because it was so good or bad

[00:55:24] me is only sitting as me and you this too is only talking to each other understand i can only

[00:55:31] talk to me and give my understanding i cannot talk to anybody else and give my understanding

[00:55:36] so the me resides in this as me is reciting and all of that is me so the me through this me

[00:55:42] talking to me and the doodja stares at the crowd like he said something that meant something but

[00:55:47] it's like powerful and i thought one of the coolest things about that doc at first i was kind of like

[00:55:51] i can't really understand how the india media portrays it it was confusing but then to see how

[00:55:57] the media and how they digest their content and the idiosyncrasies of their culture i thought

[00:56:01] ended up being one of the cooler aspects of that doc absolutely because you can see the pattern

[00:56:05] and just how they're susceptible in ways that you and i aren't and vice versa and yet the

[00:56:11] templates once again exactly the same me residing in me as me what does that mean well that's the

[00:56:17] thing you make something out of it you think it's him yeah right that's the nature of word salad

[00:56:21] anyway i hope you guys learned hope it was informative yeah hope you learned hope you have a fabulous

[00:56:26] summer stay tuned for those bonus episodes and we'll see you in the fall for season five of a

[00:56:33] little bit culty let's keep the conversation going we'll be back soon with more episodes of a

[00:56:52] little bit culty with more experts and survivors and sometimes experts who are survivors as well

[00:56:58] as some familiar faces from the vow from hbo if you've got suggestions or questions on upcoming

[00:57:04] topics find us on instagram at a little bit cult and for more background on what brought me here

[00:57:09] my memoir scarred the true story of how i escaped nexium the cult that bound my life is available

[00:57:15] on amazon audible and where most books are sold if you like to help us spread the word about

[00:57:20] a little bit culty podcast please give us a five star review and tell your friends to

[00:57:23] subscribe seriously like take out their phone and tell them to press subscribe takes a second

[00:57:28] we're also available on apple podcasts spotify in every major listening app and if you're listening

[00:57:33] on a smartphone tap or swipe over the cover art of this podcast to find show notes and helpful

[00:57:38] resources you might also find some offers from our sponsors there and when you support our

[00:57:42] sponsors you help us keep this podcast going just don't be a little bit culty about it

[00:57:47] a little bit culty is executive produced by me your co-host sarah edmundson and anthony nippy

[00:57:52] aims that's me associate producer is just tardy produced edited mixed and mastered by citizens of

[00:57:59] sound our amazing theme song cultivated is by john bryant and co-written by nigel assilin i'm

[00:58:06] sarah edmundson and thanks for listening to a little bit culty